You Must Be Some Kind of Therapist

Today I welcome the esteemed Dr. Joseph Burgo to discuss the psychological crisis of males who find refuge in a trans identity. Along the way, we explore myriad contributing factors, from shame, narcissism, and autogynephilia; to rising rates of autism and unlimited access to increasingly obscene internet pornography; as well as gender roles, norms, expectations, and recent cultural shifts.

As we unravel the narratives of ex-military men and individuals in positions of power who transition, we uncover the complexities of idealization and devaluation in trans identification and the numerous parallels with personality disorder traits. How do societal norms and social justice narratives fuel the shallow idealization of the opposite gender?

We also touch on the challenges detransitioners face in therapy and the obstacles therapists encounter in providing effective care for individuals with gender ideation. How can therapists navigate the tense climate surrounding gender identity exploration? And what role should exploration of fantasies and projections play in understanding the complexities of gender distress? 

Joseph Burgo, Ph.D. is a licensed clinical psychologist and graduate psychoanalyst who has been practicing for more than 40 years. As a writer, he’s the author of several works of non-fiction bringing his insights and experience as a therapist to a popular audience, and his articles and commentary on the topics of shame and narcissism have appeared in the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Wall Street Journal, and most of the large news outlets online. In his private practice, he currently focuses on gender distress, and works with trans-identified adolescent boys, male detransitioners, and men who struggle with autogynephilia. He can be reached at joeburgo@gmail.com; find him on X @jburgo55; visit his website at AfterPsychotherapy.com; or view him in the documentary film of another former guest, Jennifer Lahl (from episodes 52 and 97), The Lost Boys: Searching for Manhood.

Dr. Burgo's books:

All books mentioned on this podcast and written by my guests can be found at sometherapist.com/bookshop or by following the Amazon affiliate links. Thank you for purchases that support the show.

00:00 Start

[00:02:49] Autism diagnosis evolution.

[00:06:36] Psychology in developmental framework.

[00:08:02] Rise in autism due to screens.

[00:11:55] Shame and narcissism in youth.

[00:18:45] Shame defiance.

[00:21:03] Adolescence and privacy for development.

[00:25:37] Exploring views on pornography.

[00:29:36] Effects of intense porn consumption.

[00:32:55] Autogynephilia as narcissism and desire.

[00:37:40] Ex-military men and transgender identity.

[00:40:58] Grass is greener syndrome.

[00:46:03] Idealization and devaluation in identity.

[00:49:50] The impact of societal beliefs.

[00:52:17] Avoiding adult responsibilities.

[00:56:20] Emancipating children's decision-making.

[01:01:27] Detransitioning experiences.

[01:02:43] Detransitioning experiences and insights.

[01:08:15] Importance of finding healing relationships.

[01:10:15] Lack of ICD procedure codes for detransition.

[01:13:42] Self-care reminder.

TALK TO ME: book a discovery call.

LOCALS: Ask questions of me & guests; get early access to new episodes + exclusive content. Join my community.

SUPPORT THE SHOW: subscribe, like, comment, & share or donate.

DO NO HARM: join our community of concerned professionals.

EIGHTSLEEP: Take $200 off your EightSleep Pod Pro Cover with code SOMETHERAPIST.

ORGANIFI: Take 20% off Organifi with code SOMETHERAPIST.

Watch NO WAY BACK: The Reality of Gender-Affirming Care. Use code SOMETHERAPIST to take 20% off your order. Follow us on X @2022affirmation or Instagram at @affirmationgeneration. 

SHOW NOTES & transcript with help from SwellAI.

MUSIC: Thanks to Joey Pecoraro for our song, “Half Awake,” used with gratitude & permission. 

To support this show, please leave a rating & review on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Subscribe, like, comment & share via my YouTube channel. Or recommend this to a friend!

Learn more about Do No Harm.

Take $200 off your EightSleep Pod Pro Cover with code SOMETHERAPIST at EightSleep.com.

Take 20% off all superfood beverages with code SOMETHERAPIST at Organifi.

Check out my shop for book recommendations + wellness products.

Show notes & transcript provided with the help of SwellAI.

Special thanks to Joey Pecoraro for our theme song, “Half Awake,” used with gratitude and permission.

Watch NO WAY BACK: The Reality of Gender-Affirming Care (our medical ethics documentary, formerly known as Affirmation Generation). Stream the film or purchase a DVD. Use code SOMETHERAPIST to take 20% off your order. Follow us on X @2022affirmation or Instagram at @affirmationgeneration.

Have a question for me? Looking to go deeper and discuss these ideas with other listeners? Join my Locals community! Members get to ask questions I will respond to in exclusive, members-only livestreams, post questions for upcoming guests to answer, plus other perks TBD.